Project: Street Beetle to Subaru powered Sand Bug

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Post by quad1100 » Sun Jun 27, 2004 6:58 pm

Ahhh, nice to see an update, doing a great job Scott!

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Post by snewbank » Mon Jun 28, 2004 10:04 am

r erfert wrote:Very nice so far...I noticed in your picture of the bender that you did not have a spacer under the slide block?? that holds the tubing to the die...It helps in keeping the tubing centered in the die.

don't for your tag on the trans that reads NO OIL.

Does the bender come with a spacer or is that optional? I went right to work building the worm gear thingy before putting the bender together. with parts scattering everywhere, I just wonder if I have the spacer and don't know it. That might explain why I keep getting gouges on the top of the tube when bending even though I already deburred the slide block with a flapper disc as they recommend in the destructions.

Either way, I guess I could make a spacer easy enough. I have some 3/4 ID tubing that shoudl do the trick.

Tranny - I already put oil in it. Just got to take the tag off.

Thanks for all the comments.
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by r erfert » Wed Jun 30, 2004 12:01 am

[quote="snewbank"]
Does the bender come with a spacer or is that optional? quote]
Mine did not come with one...I think is was in my instructions that it was to be made to support/center the block.
Still working on a spacer for mine.

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Post by snewbank » Tue Jul 27, 2004 4:36 pm

Time for an Update:

I got to work on the rear wheel wheels where the shocks come through into the passenger compartment. I needed a way to seal it so sand doesn't come blowing into the car. Especially since my A/C blower will be mounted right there. I don't won't the blower to suck in sand and then blow it into my face through the dash vents (that would suck). So I came-up with a metal sleeve and shock boot approach to seal it.

First, I bought some 26ga sheet metal from Home Depot so I could make some templates (and proof of concept) using a pair of sheet metal shears. I had to make sure the shocks would clear the sleeves as they articulate from full rebound to full compression.

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Once I had that worked out, I transferred my measurements to some 20ga sheet. The hard part here was bending the sheet into a tube that was perfectly round. I wrapped the sheets around my Acetylene tank (which happens to be the right diameter) and used some racheting tiedowns to get it to bend around it. Then I welded the seam (after taking it off the Acetylene tank of course), trimmed off some of the metal and mounted it in the hole.

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Since I was putting a round tube in a square hole, I had to use some pieces of 20ga to "cut it in". I still have a problem with trying to MIG weld thin gauge metal without burning through. This time I used a spool of .023 wire instead of the .030 I usually use for stuff and I tried setting the power and speed according to the chart for this gauge of metal but still would burn through real easily. Ultimately, I had to do a bunch of tack welds to keep from burning through. It looks horrible but at least it's solid and I should be able to cover it up with carpet and bondo quite nicely :).

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Next, I needed to make some pliable boots to seal out the sand but still let the shock move around relative to the metal sleeves I just made. So, I bought a sewing machine and a yard of pleather. I never used a sewing machine before and it was quite a learning experience. The second boot came-out much better than the first but both look fine. I am using shoe strings to seal the boots at the sleeve and the shock. It should work pretty good. I hope.

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Finally, I Bondo'd the outside. Sanding is going slow though since it's a concave surface. You can't really use any power tools on a concave surface. It should look good when it's finished and painted though.

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Tired of sanding, I worked on some other stuff.

I installed another eye bolt up front for towing. Originally, I was going to drill through the lower beam for added towing strength but I remembered the thru-rods just as I started drilling (Doh!). So I mounted the eyebolt to the front clip and reinforced it with some 3/8" plate.

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Also, I made a removable cover for the hole in the front clip so the tunnel won't fill-up with sand.

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While I had the rear shocks off, I took the opportunity to make some changes to the shock mounts. Per Winston Cup's recommendation (way back when), I added a cross-brace to the mounts on the trailing arms to distribute the weight across the arm to minimize any flexing and fatiguing in the center.

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Also, (as discussed before) I added some gussets to the upper shock mount bosses. I agree, double shear mounts would have been better but I would have to redo the entire shock mount tower to convert it now. So I figure, I'll try this way and if the 1/2" Grade-9 bolts I'm using start to bend then I'll remake the shock towers so I can use a double sheer mount.

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I did some work on the dash. I bought a pre-cut aluminum dash for $22 awhile ago and decided it was too thin and didn't look that good. So, I decided to make my own out of polished Diamond Plate aluminum just for something a little different. I figured I could use the pre-cut dash as a template but when I looked at it a little closer, I noticed that the person who cut it out must have been drunk and unable to follow the lines. Also, it didn't fit exactly right. So instead of duplicating this lousy piece of work, I decided to make mine from scratch. The problem is the dash has a very slight arc to it (both on the top and bottom) and the bottom arc is a little less then the top arc. Also, it was very difficult to scribe the arcs on a piece of paper since the top arc is slightly inset into the dash. So, I used my freebee copy of TurboCad 2D to replicate the arcs and create a template. I printed it out 1:1 across four 8.5 x 11 sheets of paper, taped them together and cut it out. The template matches the arc on the dash perfectly.

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BTW - I also used TurboCad 2D to make the templates for the pleather boots I made for the shocks. I'm finding CAD is a great way to make templates for custom parts.

I used some carpet protector (self-adhesive saran wrap type stuff) to protect the Diamond Plate finish, used the template to mark it, cut it out with the jigsaw and bolted it on using some stainless steel button head bolts.

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I decided to mount the ECU under the rear bench seat. More specifically, I want to make some compartments under the rear seat with hinged doors that flip down and mount the ECU, Fuse Block and Relays to the back of the door itself. That way, If (when) I have electrical problems, I can access all the electrical by flipping the door down and I wont have to reach under the seat to get at anything. It will all be on the door itself.

However, I had a little problem. When I installed the roll cage, I wasn't thinking that far ahead and I didn't even know that I would eventually have to use the stock bench seat because bucket seats wont fit in the back. When I installed the roll cage, I bolted the legs of the main roll hoop too far back. The feet were interfering with the location of the rear seat compartments that I now want to install. Also, when I put the bench back in, the roll cage was binding on the bench seat so I bent the legs forward to clear the seat so the roll cage legs are no longer straight. This will create a problem later on when I go to make some seat belt mounts for the front seat.

I am planning on making a hinged bar behind the front seats. The bar will swing back and lock into place when passengers get in the rear - Kind of like a roller coaster restraint where you pull the bar back in to your lap and it locks in place - (how appropriate :> ). This bar will serve three purposes:

1.) A place to mount the front seat belt shoulder harnesses.
2.) Give passengers in back something to hang on to (instead of the roll cage itself where they could pinch their hands in a roll).
3.) Instill absolute terror into the unsuspecting first time passenger :>

But, in order to do all this right, I had to remake the center section of the roll cage. Basically, I copied the original design without the added bends to clear the bench seat I made later and instead just mounted the feet farther forward. Another benefit of remaking this piece is the original piece is made out of .083 (or maybe .095) wall tubing. The new piece is made out of .125 wall tubing so it should be much stronger. Here is a picture of the piece I had to reconstruct partially completed on the right (That old tube bender is starting to pay for itself).

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Anyway, after taking a few steps back, I could start working forward again. I had some of the diamond plate I used for the dash left over so I used that to make the compartment doors. I welded some angle iron to the bottom of the bench seat support bracket so I could mount the compartment faces slightly recessed. Then I bolted the faces on.

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The yellow lines on the diamond plate are where I will cut the doors out of after I mount the hinges. I'll upload more pictures when I'm done with it.

Well, that's where I'm at right now. After finishing the compartment doors, I can mount the ECU, Fuse Block and Relays.
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by TLB » Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:01 pm

Looks like you were busy since I checked last.
I bet you can't wait to get it done :P

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Post by snewbank » Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:11 pm

Yes, I want to get this thing done so I can work on some other projects for a change. Two months 'till dune season begins. I got to finish this and do some repairs on my old buggy to get it ready for a trip.
Scott

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Post by porboy » Wed Jul 28, 2004 4:03 pm

It is looking great. It is giving me inspiration to get my class 11 finished. Keep up the good work.

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Post by MT Buggies » Mon Aug 02, 2004 2:53 pm

Still rocking and rollin'!
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Post by porboy » Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:13 pm

Just an idea for your rear shock mounts. I apologize for the crude design but I think you can get the idea.

Image

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Post by snewbank » Tue Aug 03, 2004 10:01 am

Yea, That doesn't look like it would be too hard to do.

Thanks for the :idea: , Jason.
Scott

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Post by snewbank » Mon Aug 09, 2004 11:06 am

Time for another update.

I finished the doors under the rear seat and mounted the EMS. It just barely fits. I had to notch the angle iron to get it to clear.

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Also, I mounted the gauges in the dash. Autometer instructs you to use a 2-1/16" hole saw to mount their gauges. I couldn't find a 2-1/16" hole saw (most hole saws come in increments of an 1/8" or 1/4"). Pretty lame engineering on the part of Autometer. In any case, I used a 2" hole saw and when you take into account the wobble of a hole saw as it cuts, it made a 2-1/32" hole. I used a Dremel to round the hole out another 1/32" so the Gauges would fit. The Tach is 3-3/8". Again I couldn't find a 3-3/8" hole saw so I used a 3-1/2" hole saw and used a piece of weather stripping to make a grommet for it. It worked great.

From Left to Right: Fuel Gauge, Oil Pressure, Tachometer, Water Temp and Voltage.

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I have been looking for some affordable seats for some time. The seats need to flip forward (to get into the back seat), have side bolsters (to keep from sliding around when driving sideways down a hill) and holes in the seat back for 4 point harnesses. The only seats I could find that had all this were Corbeau seats and they want $320 each! ($740 for both).

Finally, my girlfriend found a pair of seats in the Recycler that seem to be perfect (I didn't even think to check the Recycler). Reclining/flip-forward seat backs, Side Bolsters, pass-through holes for seat belts AND they have sliders. Brand New, still in the box, $225 for BOTH. Here they are:

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The guy I bought them from said they are Sparco knockoffs made in China. They have a steel tube frame and seem as strong as any other car seat.


I had to cut out the old seat mounts/sliders from the floor pan....

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...and weld in some new ones to fit the new seats. I was going to tie the new seat mounts into the center tunnel and the door sills for more strength but I ran into a number of problems with that idea. Finally, I decided to just mount them to the floor pan (Hey, it was strong enough for the stock seat mounts, right? Besides, its the seat belts that take most of the force in a crash). I used some 1-1/4"x .125 wall square tubing to make a square frame and welded that to the floor pan. The seat bolts will mount through these and have a backing plate underneath the floor pan for added strength. Also, I am using a couple pieces 1-1/4"x .125 sq tubing as spacers so the seats are actually mounted 2-1/2" above the floor pan. With this approach. I can add/remove spaces of different size to adjust the seat height. I haven't completely finished the seat mounts yet but this is what they look like so far.

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Prior to finding the seats, I was working on the battery compartment. I bought an Optima sealed battery and was building a mount for it under the seat using angle iron when I discovered a crack in one corner of the floor pan where it had rusted through. The previous owner must have bondo'd it and that's why I didn't notice it before. I was thinking of replacing the whole floor pan half on the passenger side but decided against it. It would set me back quite a bit of time. Instead, I'm just going to make a reinforced battery mount that ties into the high side edges of the floor pan where there isn't any rust damage. It should be strong enough.

Also, I bought a Starter and battery cables. I'm going to start work on that when the seats mounts are done.
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by snewbank » Mon Aug 16, 2004 11:46 am

Well, I decided to build the rear seat lap bar after finishing the front seat mounts. I needed something to attach the front shoulder straps to and seem

I spent a lot of time trying to come-up with a design that would be simple to build, strong, easy to latch/unlatch, and be easy to get in and out of the back seat. After tossing around a bunch of designs, I decided on this one: a T-bar with a captured bolt head on each side. Here are some pictures of it.

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I fabricated it out of:

- 1.5" (.125 wall) tubing with pieces of 1.75" (.125 wall) tubing slipped over the ends for added strength and to make it the right diameter for the square tubing.
- 2" square tubing .125 wall
- 1.5"x 3/16" steel plate
- 1/2" grade-8 bolts
- two springs

I cut 4" lengths of 2" sq tubing, notched one end (at a slight angle) and cut part of one side off and rounded the corner off. Then, I used my mini-lathe to round-off the heads to the 1/2" bolts (see picture).

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I welded a couple of grade-C nuts to the back side of the round tubing and screwed in the 1/2" bolts until they touched the latches. These pictures should explain the rest of it:

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Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by Scooby-Dune » Mon Aug 16, 2004 3:49 pm

Kewl, it looks a car from Mr. Toad's wild ride at Disneyland. "Keep your hands and feet inside while the car is in motion". :shock: :shock: :shock:

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Post by snewbank » Mon Aug 16, 2004 4:00 pm

Scooby-Dune wrote:Kewl, it looks a car from Mr. Toad's wild ride at Disneyland. "Keep your hands and feet inside while the car is in motion". :shock: :shock: :shock:
I was thinking of adding some kind of ratcheting mechanism at the bottom of the "T" just to give it that click-click-click sound when you get in :twisted:
Scott

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Post by snewbank » Mon Aug 30, 2004 5:02 pm

Update:

I've been working on the Electrical lately. A couple of months ago, I started putting together a Wiring Diagram using a schematics capture program. I made a lot of changes but I think it is finally finished.

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Below is a link to a full sized image of the 3505 x 2478 resolution Wiring Diagram (so you can actually read it). You might have to zoom in a little. If you hold you cursor over the image for a couple seconds in IE 6.0, it will give you a button to view it full-sized.

http://www.americansandassociation.org/ ... agram3.gif


Here is a picture of the panel/hatch door under the rear bench seat with the FI Computer, Relays and Fuse Block mounted.

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I decided to mount the front Relays and Fuse Blocks to a 2" wide x 16" long strip of 1/8" aluminum and mount the strip with some stand-off posts. This way, I don't have to drill so many holes in the body plus I don't need someone to hold a wrench inside while I use a screwdriver outside just to remove a relay. Also, since it was aluminum, I had to polish of course :)

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I made a new battery mount since the floor pan was/is starting to rust through (as VW floorpans always do under the battery) and I'm not big on replacing the floorpan half's yet. I use some 1" x 1/8" Angle Iron and welded on some 3/8" threaded rod and made a top mounting plate/strap. Unfortunately, I forgot to take pictures of it.

I wired-up the starter with 4ga (the thickest gauge I could get at Pep-boys [Have you ever noticed that despite the "at Pepboys - We got it" motto, they hardly ever have anything that you need! Thirteen isles of furry-dice and simulated chrome-plastic spoked wheel hub caps and three isles of auto-parts. Grrr] ). Anyway, I wired-up the alternator with 4ga too and brought that back to the battery through a 175A Mega Fuse. This is where I brought-out 2x 10ga wires to the rear relays and 2x 10ga to the front relays. Here is a picture of the Mega Fuse with 3/8" bolts for the connections. I'm going to wrap it with electrical tape then plastic wire conduit and more electrical tape (don't want it to ever short out against the chassis)

643a
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I had to break from the wiring and work on some time sensitive stuff. It turns-out that all those steel tube brackets, cages and racks I have been fabricating over the past months are already starting to rust (DOH!). There is surface rust all over the front beam and bumper and the radiator rack is starting to go. And I have had it in the garage all this time! I was going to wait 'till next season to paint everything but I don't think it can wait. So I stopped everything else and pulled the front-end apart so I could sand everything and paint it (I painted the front-deck with gray primer the weekend before). It would have saved me a lot of sanding (and wire wheels) if I at least primed these parts after making them. My girlfriend helped out with a lot of the sanding and masking but it still took-up most of the weekend. Here is a picture of the front-end after painting it semi-gloss black (not too bad saying as it came from a can).

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Here is a picture of the Radiator rack with semi-gloss Black.

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I still need to sand and paint the rear bumper, ramp under the tranny horns, the 2" sq tubing I welded across the stock shock towers, the rear deck to tranny horn braces and the gas tank rack. I'm hoping the interior stuff like the roll cage will hold out 'till next summer when I plan on tearing the whole thing down and sending the body to the painters to get a coat of Pearl Blue while I paint the chassis, floorpan, roll cage and remaining bare steel parts semi-gloss black.

I did get some more wiring done. I'm almost finished with dash and rear panel. I will post some pictures when I'm done.
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by BHenry » Mon Aug 30, 2004 7:29 pm

Thats some of the neatest (cleanest) electrical wiring I have seen 8)

This has been one of my favorite threads, keep up the good work snew.
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Post by Scooby-Dune » Tue Aug 31, 2004 11:27 am

The wiring job is awesome! I'd be nervous too about the mega fuse. :shock: Isn't there a better location/way to mount that? Or, is that temporary for the picture? The paint looks good for a spray can. I had to do a whole front fender/quarter panel in two tone paint on an El Camino once. Krylon had the two exact colors in cans. After sanding, I came out good enough to sell. What I really like is the schematic. 8) How many people spend the time to make one of those?

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Post by MT Buggies » Tue Aug 31, 2004 3:08 pm

Snew-
What program are you using for the schematics? That's an awesome idea and something I would be interested in.

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Post by snewbank » Tue Aug 31, 2004 4:09 pm

MT Buggies wrote:Snew-
What program are you using for the schematics? That's an awesome idea and something I would be interested in.

-Shaun
I used an old Pirated copy of Orcad but I think there are some shareware schematics capture programs on the web. I would try download.com.
Scott

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Post by snewbank » Tue Aug 31, 2004 4:16 pm

BTW - The reason I created a wiring diagram is so I can can keep a copy stashed somewhere in the buggy. That way, if I have an electrical problem some years in the future (or some future owner does) and can't remember how I wired everything, I have something to refer to.

Thanks for the compliments.
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by quad1100 » Tue Aug 31, 2004 4:16 pm

That's some great work!

Sorry, I had thought about an E-ticket ride at Disneyland too when I saw that T bar, the click, click, click would be a nice one.

Regarding your hole saw problem, I like you use McMaster Carr as my golden book to see if anyone actually makes a certain tool or whatever. In this case they do carry that 2-1/6 size and 3-3/8 size saws, for future reference.

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Post by wanadune2 » Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:11 pm

when you wrap the mega fuse with tape, you should look into something called slpicing tape , they sell it at home depot, you rap it over the lugs fist like electrical tape then you just cover that with some regular electrical tape either way looks clean so far

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Post by snewbank » Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:32 pm

wanadune2 wrote:when you wrap the mega fuse with tape, you should look into something called slpicing tape , they sell it at home depot, you rap it over the lugs fist like electrical tape then you just cover that with some regular electrical tape either way looks clean so far
Is that the really thick tape stuff for insulation?
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by wanadune2 » Thu Sep 02, 2004 4:01 pm

you got it thats the stuff

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Post by snewbank » Fri Sep 10, 2004 4:51 pm

Still working on the electrical and other small things. It's starting to look like when I finally get the engine ready to start the first time I will only be a couple hours away from completing everything else and taking it for a ride. Maybe 3-4 more weeks to go.
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by TEMPORARY INSANITY » Sat Sep 11, 2004 11:29 pm

Hey Scott--

This thing looks like one MAJOR time consuming project, great job though!

Something I noticed in your picts that WILL be a problem...

Those hose clamps on your CV boots are going to cut in and destroy your boots in short order!

20 to 30 gauge wire or Zip ties are a much better choice.

Just my unsolicited advice.
Larry Linkins
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WEAR WRIST RESTRAINTS!
The hand you save may be yours!!

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Post by TEMPORARY INSANITY » Sat Sep 11, 2004 11:51 pm

One more thing.

The "T" bar in the back seat looks trick, but looks like Lawyer fodder to me.

My buddy had a Nissan with an in the cab roll cage that he built. A bar ran across the front of the dash. He hit a riverbed washout and slammed his and the passenger's faces into the bar. The passenger knocked out most of his teeth, and broke his jaw almost off. and ripped the corners of his mouth to his ears. My buddy crushed in his eye sockets, cheek bones , and shoved his nasal cartilidge into the frontal lobe of his brain, and was on life support for 2 weeks and lived.

Something to think about.
Larry Linkins
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WEAR WRIST RESTRAINTS!
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Post by snewbank » Mon Sep 13, 2004 11:00 am

I was concerned about the hose clamps too when I was installing them. I wonder why they provide them with the kit. I might take your suggestion and use zip ties instead.

Regarding the "T-Bar", The whole reason I put it in was so I had a place to mount the shoulder straps of the front seat belts. Since I am using 4-point seat belts front and back, there should be no way a rear passenger could slam into the "T-Bar". Did your friend have 4-point seat belts or just the stock seat belts?
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Post by TEMPORARY INSANITY » Mon Sep 13, 2004 9:18 pm

My friend and his buddy had 5 points on, but had the shoulder harnesses WAY too loose.
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Post by snewbank » Wed Sep 15, 2004 2:27 pm

The past few days I have been stuck in disc brake hell. I created a whole new topic for this nightmare.

http://www.americansandassociation.org/ ... hp?t=16185


Can't really move forward until I get this resolved
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Post by TEMPORARY INSANITY » Wed Sep 15, 2004 9:18 pm

I can't see how any master cylinder could possibly create enough pressure to blow pistons and crack housings. I've hammered my brake pedal HARD numerous times and never had so much as a weep.

I wonder what grade and hardness the aluminum is that your calipers are made of ?.

Kartek and Wildood calipers are super fine, but they don't come with the cool tribal engravings. I suspect the calipers to be at fault.

By any chance are you using that new self expanding, nuclear fission, Dot 9000 brake fluid ? I heard that stuff is pretty nasty!! :wink:
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Post by snewbank » Thu Sep 16, 2004 2:45 pm

I think your right. The calipers are at fault. I updated the thread with last nights findings.

The Wildwoods do look Heavy Duty but are very expensive.
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Post by snewbank » Wed Sep 22, 2004 11:42 am

Still working on the brake issue. See this thread for an update.

http://www.americansandassociation.org/ ... hp?t=16185
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Post by snewbank » Wed Oct 06, 2004 2:29 pm

Well, I think I got the brakes worked-out. Here are some pictures of my new pedal setup.

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I won't know how well they stop with the 1-1/16" MC I'm using until I get the thing running.

In the meanwhile, I've been working on some other stuff. I got the throttle cable worked-out. Originally, I bought a standard 9' heavy duty VW throttle cable with the cheap Teflon tubing but it didn't look like it was long enough to go all the way to the back, over the engine and curve back to the throttle body (like other setups I saw at the SSSS) and that was the only size I could find. So, I bought a 10' Morse Cable and that still wasn't long enough because I couldn't make as tight of a bend with the Morse. So I bought a 11' Morse and although it would reach, I found that the bend radius had to be huge with the Morse and there was a lot of other problems with the Morse style cable for my setup. So, I went back to the original 9' standard cable I had and found a cleaner way of routing it. I was concerned that this way may pinch the cable between the bell housing and firewall if the engine ever started twisting under torque but after looking at it closer, I don't think that will be much of a problem especially since I will have reinforcement bars between the bell housing and firewall to stabilize the tranny horns.

Anyway, here is a picture of how I routed it (you can see I still need to trim the excess cable off at the clevis).

Image

I took a block of aluminum and drilled a 1/8" hole through at an angle (for the cable) and then drilled halfway into the other side of the hole with a 3/16" bit (to hold the cable housing/Teflon tubing). There was an unused threaded bolt hole on the engine block that I was able to bolt this aluminum block to. Here is a close-up of the block

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I even made this clevis out of a block of aluminum! I know I've said this before, but sometimes it is quicker to fabricate these parts out of scraps laying around then it is to get in the car and drive around looking for something that's off the shelf.

Image

I also made this cable mount for the foot pedal end. I drilled a 1/8" hole all the way through and chased it half way in with a 3/16" drill bit for the cable housing. I rounded all the edges off the block so it wont bite my ankle when using the throttle pedal.

Image

I've been working on a number of other pieces like the surge tank, idle control, speedometer, wiring, etc in parallel so they should all be completing around the same time and I should have some more pictures pretty soon.
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Post by TEMPORARY INSANITY » Wed Oct 06, 2004 8:56 pm

Nice little clevis and cable bracket!

Stuff like this is nearly impossible to find anywhere. I have a Engineer/Machinist buddy who fabs things like this for me, but these little things are time consuming. He spent many hours making me 2 billet wink mirror mounts, only to find out later that Tatum has them for $15.
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Post by dirtminnow » Sat Oct 09, 2004 9:18 pm

Winston Cup wrote:
snewbank wrote:I bought this cheapo one at Harbor Freight. Haven't even tried it yet. I hope it works.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/D ... mber=32888

Um, that won't work, it's a pipe bender. Tube dies are sized OD, pipe dies are sized ID for one thing. Also it doesn't have anything to keep the tube snug in the die. Hard to explain. That bender will crush and kink the tube, definitely need a different bender and you won't find it there.

One like this
Image

This is the one I have right at the moment.

I have a harbor Fr bender and if you fill the pipe/tube with sand and cap the ends it works a little better - less kinking. Also put some shims over the pipe/tube your bending to minimize kinks. Haven't built anything for my bug but had plenty of rollovers on the external cage I built for my 4x4 toyota pu.

PS Awsome job on your bug!!!!!!!
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Post by snewbank » Mon Oct 11, 2004 3:57 pm

Update:

Well, I got a lot done this weekend. My brother came over to help and between the two of us, we got a lot done.

First, I put the speedo setup together. Like I said before, instead of spending $200 on a Autometer Speedometer, I went to Target and bought a Schwinn Bicycle Computer for $13. It's much smaller (since I don't have much room in the dash) and has a lot more functions than the Autometer speedo. Such as Max Speed, Average Speed, current speed, 2 trip odometers, overall odometer, total ride time and a clock plus it weighs less too. Anyway, I made a custom bracket to bolt the sensor to the front drivers side spindle and a I drilled a small hole in the hub and JB Welded the supplied magnet in it. Here are a couple of pictures.

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Then I mounted the computer to the dash next to the fuel gauge.

Image

I made a surge tank a couple weeks ago out of a length of 2.5" exhaust tubing, welded some end caps on, welded in three NPT bungs and welded some standoff legs to it to mount it to the front firewall under the gas tank (gravity fed). Painted it aluminum (to make it weigh less ;) ). Here is a picture.

Image

I ended up using some big 3/4" ID tubing to connect the surge tank to the bottom of the gas tank to make sure it fills the surge tank quickly if air is trapped in the surge tank but you can see below that the hose is a little kinked from the tight bends. Also, I had to use some high pressure air hose (the only thing with 3/4" ID I could find). I hope it will be ok.

Image

Image

Also, I made an Idle control out of some scrap materials last week. I can't get to the set screw that controls the butterfly valve easily because the firewall is in the way so I decided to make a Manual Idle Air Control Valve to replace the electronic one. I may try to get the electronic one to work later but it is a 6-pin servo type IAC and I don't have any electrical specs on it to make a control circuit yet. I'm thinking I may need it to compensate for the AC compressor on/off. A 555 timer setup as a PWM may work nicely. But for now, I'll just use this to manually control the idle. Here is couple pictures.

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Here is a picture of the stock gas tank installed on the raised mount I made to clear the steering rack.

Image

We painted the wheel wells. It didn't come-out as good as I expected but this is only temporary paint to protect the metal until next season when I get the entire body painted Pearl Blue.

Image

I got some more of the electrical done too. It's been taking a lot of time partly because I am soldering every "solderless" crimp. I'm tired of crimp-ends that come off the wire. Also, I am putting shrink tubing on a every connector as well as installing the flexible wire loom conduit. It starting to look like a factory wire harness and should survive a nuclear blast. We were hoping to start the engine last night but ran out of time.

Anyway, I only have eight more connectors to solder-on and the electrical is done. Then I can mount the radiator and try starting the engine. Hopefully, I will get that done this week. Then I just need to reinstall some of the things I already fitted but took out to leave room to work (such as the seats, reinforcement brackets, rear shocks, etc ), I'm hoping to be able to throw my rusty street tires on it and take it for a spin around the block by next weekend and if all goes well, we'll be at Gordons for Halloween Weekend :) :) :)
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Post by LoBuck » Mon Oct 11, 2004 8:41 pm

snewbank wrote:.. and if all goes well, we'll be at Gordons for Halloween Weekend :lol: :lol: :lol:
Scott, you better post it if you do have it ready :!: There are a lot of us waiting to see that thing with our own eyeballs :!: :D

It looks like we may be having a YumaDuner Dinner Halloween weekend. We're still trying to get it decided.
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Surge Tank?

Post by dirtminnow » Mon Oct 11, 2004 9:17 pm

This may be a dumb question but what is the surge tank for? Anyone have suggestions for a good fuel cell or tank other than stock?

I'm hooking up a EFI 16v 2.0 Jetta motor in my buggy and for an intermediate mechanic its a miracle in itself... :oops:

PS I've scoured the web for tasty information about engine swaps and this write up is a 11 out of 10 for sure. The detail and descriptive nature are truly awsome. I gotta say THANKS, you've given me a ton of ideas and I've learned alot. \:D/
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Post by snewbank » Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:55 am

dirtminnow wrote:This may be a dumb question but what is the surge tank for?
That is a good question. A few weeks ago, I wasn't even sure what a "surge tank" was.


Fuel Injection Systems 101 (according to Scott):

With FI engines you have to use a high pressure fuel pump (50+ PSI) in order to force the fuel through the injectors fast enough and get good atomization of the fuel particles. However, most high pressure fuel pumps don't like to be "stalled" (all pressure with little or no fuel flow). So, the fuel system is setup to recirculate most of the fuel. The fuel is circulated from the gas tank to the fuel pump to the fuel rail to the pressure regulator and then back to the gas tank. Only a small amount of the fuel in the fuel rail is actually fed through the injectors and the rest of the fuel is fed back to the gas tank. This allows plenty of fuel to flow through the fuel pump and keep the motor from burning out.

The problem with this setup is that when your gas tank is low and you take a hard corner, the gas swishes up the side of the gas tank exposing the fuel feed hole on the bottom of the tank to air for a second and as a result, the fuel pump sucks huge volumes of air into the fuel line, forces it into the fuel rail and when the injectors open, there is no fuel to spray just air. Consequently, your engine stumbles or even stalls for lack of fuel. You may have noticed this phenomena in stock fuel injected cars when your almost empty and you take a tight corner (like a u-turn) and accelerate hard, the engine will suddenly stumble for a second (as if someone just shut off the ignition). Your head whips forward and then the engine suddenly kicks in again with full power.

This can be a real problem for an offroad vehicle. Such as when you are driving sideway across a hill, or up a steep hill or down a hill or jumping, etc. Even if you gas tank is almost full. If you stall on a hill you might not be able to restart it because the gas tank is oriented in such a way that your fuel pump is only sucking air. You would have tow the car down to level ground in order to restart the engine. That's a worst case scenario but it could happen.

So, the surge tank is created. A surge tank is kind of like a small reservoir (maybe 1 litre or less) that is constantly kept full from the main fuel tank. In my case, the fuel pump pulls gas from the surge tank (reservoir) and is fed to the fuel rail through the pressure regulator and back to the surge tank. Only the gas in the surge tank is recirculated through the fuel system and the main fuel tank keeps the surge tank always full of fuel. My surge tank is gravity feed from the main tank (mounted under the fuel tank) but others are fed by a secondary low pressure fuel pump.

Here is a Website that Jason found that shows some examples.

http://sdsefi.com/techsurge.htm


This is probably more info then you wanted but there it is anyway.
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Bueno

Post by dirtminnow » Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:17 am

However, most high pressure fuel pumps don't like to be "stalled"
Thanks, that's exactly what I was looking for! My VW 2.0 16v is prob no exception! Better build one now rather than be sideways on a trail 20 miles from nowhere. :lol:
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Post by snewbank » Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:47 pm

I finished-up the electrical last night. I fed all the wiring for the engine, brake/driving lights and whip through the heater vents. Every terminal end is soldered with shrink tubing to protect it, every wire is covered by conduit wrapped with electrical tape, every hole wire is fed through has rubber grommets. So I better not have any electrical problems down the road. Here are some pictures of the engine electrical.

Image

Image

Image

I'll get some more pictures of the computer harness and front deck fuse block later.
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Post by snewbank » Wed Oct 13, 2004 11:34 am

WooHoo!!!

I started the motor last night for the first time. First I primed the fuel pump and noticed a lot of metal filings in the see through reusable fuel filter I have on the low pressure side (I kind of expected that even though I cleaned the gas tank and surge tank out as much as possible). So, I cleaned the filter and reprimed the system. Then I connected the computer and holding my breath, I turned the key from Ignition to Start...

Buh..Duh...Buh..Duh...Buh..Duh...Buh..Duh...Buh..Duh...Buh..Buh..Bu..BU..BU..Bu.Buh..Buh..Buh...Duh...Buh....Duh... Key off.

It tried to start. I fought the urge to pump the gas pedal like a VW (this is FI stupid) so I turned the key again....

Buh..Duh...Buh..Duh...Buh..Duh...Bu..Bu..BU..BU..Pah.Tato.Pah.Tato.Pah.Tato.Pah.Tato.Pah.Tato.

It fired up and went right to smooth hi idle. Purring like a kitten :D :D :D

I could breath again.

I was actually pessimistic about it firing up so easily and running perfectly from the get go. I figured I would have messed-up a wire or some fuel problem or something would happen. It was running smoothly, no missing or sounding like it's going to stall (like those stupid cold VW engines ;).

However, about 30 seconds into it running, a problem surfaced. The radiator started leaking onto the alternator. I looked and found a pin hole where coolant was streaming out of. A small problem I was happy to have compared to all the other potential problems I could have had. So, I shut-off the motor. I found an old bottle of Coastal Stop Leak in one of my cabinets (the kind with the pellets). I wasn't too big on pouring those pellets into my motor but I just had to hear the engine run some more. I poured in half a bottle according to the instructions and ran the engine again. It fired right-up and went to a smooth idle again without even touching the gas pedal (I love Electronic Fuel Injection).

After about 5 minutes the hole sealed-up for about a minute then leaked again then sealed-up again. I let run for about 15 minutes. No more leaks. Just the same, I think I'm going to replace the radiator with a new one. I pulled it out of a '90 Subaru Legacy at Pick-Your-Pocket. I was happy to get the fans and everything for $120 but I don't want to take any chances in the dunes with it leaking again. Plus, with the radiator behind, if it leaked while duning, I might not even notice it until I started overheating.

I just priced a replacement at RadiatorBarn.com. Brand New, All Metal for $100 (including shipping).

One other problem I found. The Charge Indicator stays on. The Volt Gauge reads about 14.7v when running so the alternator is definitely charging. I checked the polarity of the LED and the anode (positive) is connected to Ignition and the cathode (negative) should be connected to the alternator. I'll double check the cathode to make sure it's connected to the right place. Maybe there is a problem with using an LED for this function. If the wiring checks-out, I'll try using an incandescent and diode in place of the LED.

Other than that the engine is running great.
Scott

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Post by jhitesma » Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:58 pm

The LED may not work. Remember an LED is a "Light Emitting DIODE" and only allows current to flow one direction - while an incadesent lamp will flow current either direction. If your indicator is wired like most others I've seen it will be always hot on one side and then grounded through the regulator when the alt is not charging and see 12v on that side when the regulator does allow charging - then since the light is seeing 12v on both legs it won't light since there's no path to ground.

I'm a little out of it right now and need to draw up some circuit diagrams to think it though...but I'm fairly sure an LED won't work properly in that situation....at least not as a drop in replacement. Need some paper and pencil and a clear head to think about it though and none of those are handy at this moment :D

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Post by snewbank » Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:39 pm

According to all the diagrams I've seen, the charge light usually consists of an incandescent light in series with a blocking diode. The idea is current can flow when the voltage at the negative leg of the diode trios in the alternator are less than battery positive but not when the voltage at the trios are more than or equal to battery positive. This is how my Haynes Subaru manual shows it too (but I have seen a number of errors in the manuals Wiring Diagrams). I figured by using an LED, I'm effectively combining the function of the blocking diode and incandescent light into one piece. However, I did not take into account the fact that the 12v LED I am using has an internal resistor to limit current to a few 10's of milliamps. I don't know what kind of effect this can have on the self-exciting function that the indicator is supposed to supply to the alternator. I hope to figure it out tonight. Before or after the Debate.
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Post by TEMPORARY INSANITY » Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:07 pm

Scott--

The red hose for your surge tank feed looks like heater hose to me? If it is, it will eventually swell up like a baloon, rupture, and make a toasty pile of ashes out of all of your hard work. Make sure that you use neoprene hose. Also a kink like that will start to close off when it gets hot.

Just my observation. :wink:
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Post by snewbank » Thu Oct 14, 2004 9:46 am

TEMPORARY INSANITY wrote:Scott--

The red hose for your surge tank feed looks like heater hose to me? If it is, it will eventually swell up like a baloon, rupture, and make a toasty pile of ashes out of all of your hard work. Make sure that you use neoprene hose. Also a kink like that will start to close off when it gets hot.

Just my observation. :wink:
Actually, it is high pressure Air Hose. It has multiple layers. It seems like the inside has a thin nylon/Teflon layer surounded by black rubber with molded in thread (kind of like heater hose) and the outside layer is a red rubber. I'm concerned about it too. However, I haven'y found any 3/4" ID Fuel Hose yet so it's got to do for now. I don't like the kinking either. I wonder how clear Butyl plastic hose stands-up to gas. Anybody know what plastics/rubber you can use for gas?
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Post by snewbank » Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:52 am

Regarding the Charge Light, I rechecked the wiring last night. Every thing checks-out fine. So, I connected a 12v incandescent light I had laying around in series with a diode and the charge light started working correctly (light goes out when engine is running and alternator is charging). So, it looks like I have to replace the LED with an Incandescent and diode. I don't know why an LED won't work for this function.

FYI - To those who are not familiar with the relationship between alternators and charge indicators. They are not optional. You have to have a charge light and diode (or at least a resistor and diode). If not or if the light is burned-out, the alternator will not charge at all.

Also, I've been noticing that the fuel pump is awfully loud. It's even louder than the engine when it's running. I bolted the fuel pump directly to the firewall and it causes a lot of resonating. So, last night, I pulled it off, drilled the holes in the firewall out with a larger diameter bit and installed some rubber grommets with backing washers to isolate the vibrations from the fuel pump to the firewall. It is ten times quieter now.

I have another problem I'm trying to work out.. The throttle cable I installed (the so called "Super Heavy Duty buggy cable") uses a flimsy clear nylon plastic tube as a housing. I have found that this housing has a tendency to compress a lot with the spring resistance on my throttle body. What happens is even though the cable is taught, I can press the throttle pedal down about a 1/3 of the way before the butterfly valve even starts to come-off the idle set screw stop and then it tends to spring forward opening much further than I intended too. It's "springy" because the cable housing is compressing which doesn't give me a very good control over the throttle. I could put an a lighter tension spring on the throttle body to compensate but it is already light enough for my taste and I would rather just get a good cable housing. Something like a brake cable used on a motorcycle or bicycle. The kind of cable housing that is usually black plastic and has a wound steel layer inside to keep it from compressing. You know, a REAL cable housing. A Morse cable won't work for my application. It's too stiff for one and the ends are a problem. Plus, I understand Morse cables actually uses strands of piano wire not twisted cable which would be another problem. Regular bike cable won't work only because it has to be at least 9' long. I called Mcfadden-Dale, they suggested trying a Harley shop for a cable that's long enough for the huge ape hanger bars. Assuming they would have it, I'm sure the mark-up will be 10x because it's coming from a Harley shop :(

Anybody know where I might find a cable housing like this that is at least 9' long?
Scott

Idaho Falls

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Post by mawieche » Thu Oct 14, 2004 1:58 pm

You might try mcmaster-carr on the net. Have you thought of a hydraulic throttle?
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Post by Paleale » Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:07 pm

You could try to replace the plastic tubing with maybe some steel brake line...
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